thetechnobear's Recent Posts

"When Aalto gets t3d messages over OSC, it goes into OSC mode and stops listening to MIDI entirely. If you want to combine both OSC and MIDI I wold recommend converting the MIDI information to OSC somehow"

sorry, my question was badly worded...

automation, is not midi, and Ive tested, it still seems to respond to host control to when in OSC mode - so thats cool :)

i guess really it was two things:

a) if you are thinking of exposing the automation parameters via OSC.
(I'm guessing from your above response - no)

b) as described in my other FR post, I really would like the equivalent of CC , +1 , +2 outputs when in OSC mode.

Im guessing (b) would be useful for the soundplane too, and would perhaps be linked to the work you have done regarding zones on a soundplane.


pattern storage would be nice :)

you can work 'around' it, as the seq values and on/off are automatable - so that provides a way. e.g. you can create a M4L device to store/retrieve patterns.

Edit: even better, I just tried with Numerology 4 (five12) , link up a faderbox, paramod to aalto,
and then you can save as presets, and also have quantised morphing between patterns.
ok, this is more N4 functionality, but is possible due to aalto (& kaivo) exposing sequencer via automation.
N4 + Aalto/Kaivo is a great combination, they sort of have a similar philosophy with their modular aspects.

Randy, when using OSC are the automatation values still available, i.e. is it still listening for midi messages within the audio unit? (which messages are processed and which ignored?)

Ok, more playing yesterday... and some fresh ideas :)

x/y/z and pitchbend curves.
Ive just implemented these in my T3D drivers for the eigenharp, as sometimes you want subtle effects, other times you want more drastic changes.

the reason Im posting here, is perhaps this should also be available per preset rather than at the controller level.

(my current understanding is aalto/kaivo have linear modulation inputs, and I think the soundplane supports a curve on Z, and some quantisation on pitch?)


for 'more' percussive sounds, its useful to have a concave pressure curve,
but on a string/pad sound a more subtle linear/convex curve might be better.

similarly if I'm pitch bending for more 'continuous' type sounds, a linear curve is appropriate, but perhaps on more conventional (say a piano variant) a more concave curve - this becomes very interesting as well when we use larger pitch bend ranges.

of course these are obvious ones, but even when modulating cutoff/q etc curves are useful.

here, i do recognise the differences between the soundplanes ( & continuum) continuous surface, compared to say and eigenharps (& linnstruments) key approach with an offset. ( i think curves may be also useful with midi CC too)

(I wonder even with a soundplane, if often players would on some sounds want a more subtle pitch bend to help stay in pitch, but still allow pb with a more exaggerated move)

I do recognise the danger of introducing complexity in the UI e.g. one could argue for all inputs could have curved response, rather than putting them on the outputs.
so im not sure how/if this is something you think is worth the investment on.

anyway, as I says I've done it in the controller software, so more just a thought, about what is appropriate at 'preset level' vs controller level

an aside...
Geerts implementation of midi mapping in EigenD is interesting to look at, which you might want to look, might spark some ideas for the soundplane.

basically for every plugin parameter (or midi CC/at etc), you map it to an input (or >1) (e.g. key roll) then you can supply scaling/bounds inc mid points/inversion etc, and now in 2.1 (not in above manual yet) also a curve.

its complex, but its amazing how tuning these parameters can affect the way it feels to play certain vsts/presets... i often fine tune these on instruments I'm really keen on and use frequently.

of course with the soundplane this could be done by using Max, but i thought Id share, as its the same kind of thing I'm doing with the soundplane controller interface.

cool, note per channel will be very useful.
(perhaps also 14 bit midi CC & velocity?)

but I'm happy with t3d due to higher accuracy , would be nice to have support for slider zones though :)

summed outputs, yeah summing is also useful, and I wouldn't change as Im sure many presets depend on it, hence the idea of changing the input 'mode'.
(ok it would be nice to able to do wire1 * wire2 + wire 3, but to be honest, its too complex, so i think either sum(Wire 1..N) or product(Wire 1..N) is fine)

I agree the about the current complement of modules, theres enough for so much flexibility, without being daunting. its hard to see how you can add more to Kaivo/Aalto without sacrificing the UI..... (u-he bazille is a bit daunting at first)
only thing i can think of is having some advanced modules on another tab? perhaps with input / outputs on the sides of the patch bay?... but perhaps a V2 thing, that I'm sure you already have many ideas for :)

anyway, not a big thing, i think theres plenty of opportunities in Aalto and Kaivo, without more complexity.

Im just finalising a new 'agent' for EigenD which I think will be interesting to Soundplane owners, so thought Id post here :) (hope this is ok Randy)

EigenD is flexible and open performance environment with that can host instruments, and contains physical model instruments and things like step sequencers, recorders, etc etc.
from the beginning of June, it was made completely free (its also open source)

(yes, it was developed for the Eigenharp, but actually transcends, and is really device agnostic ... but as an Eigenharp player Im a great fan of EigenD)

my new agent (midi device) supports incoming multi channel midi at 14 bit bit res, and converts those into the native eigenD signal flows (supporting 3d touches, strips, pedals, breath etc) - a must for expressive controllers like the Soundplane.

heres a demo video :

you may also find the eigenD vst videos interesting, and I hope to add some more,
to introduce people to EigenD features.

anyway just a heads up, Id love to hear how someone gets on with a soundplane and EigenD in the future - I think a powerful combination.

As I said, it may just be my unfamiliarity with Audacity (and its ancient windows like UI :)).

What Ive been trying to do is take samples from my synth, layer them up, and chuck into Kaivo to play with - getting them into Kaivo is the easy bit, its cropping/editing in audacity that is the time consuming bit (for me).

Given, I've little idea what will work well as a sample, Im just trying to streamline this, and see what works :)

perhaps eventually I will grow to love Audacity ;)

Thanks Randy for taking the time to publish some tips, very helpful.

Id also add, that different VST/AU hosts seem to play abit of a part as well, also running in a separate host will allow OSX to do load balancing between your main host/DAW and the host with Kaivo.

Looking forward to 1.1 :)

one thing, I would like to 'streamline' is the importing of samples.
I don't really have a solution... and perhaps its just that I don't get on with Audacity, and none of my DAWs can deal with 4ch wav files :)
Ideally, perhaps it would be nice for kaivo to be able to 'capture' the sample, through audio in,
(it might have to be done in 2 steps to get the 4 channels).
Alternative, being able to specify 2x2ch, which would be easy to create from any daw.

... this has been one reason Ive not been playing with too many of my own samples, as its takes me a bit too long to get them from synth -> kaivo.

Thanks to help from Randy.

Ive managed to get EigenD (the Eigenharp software) talking natively to Kaivo/Aalto using the T3D OSC protocol of the Soundplane.
The expression in this OSC mode is amazing, I imagine, it must be fantastic on a Soundplane too.

Quick demo here:

Hope to add more features from T3D in the future!

Thanks again Randy for your help, documentation and having your code open source and most of all for producing software instruments that really add something new!


btw... i mentioned it would be useful to have an input into sustain level on the envelopes.
I think perhaps I should have said, one of the reason for this, is existing patches always end up very 'quiet', and have to be modified...
the reason for this seems to be they use x Vel on the envelopes, but there is no velocity from t3d (though of course Kaivo/aalto may be calculating one?)
or have I missed something?

so I thought perhaps route Z to sustain level (currently ive just been mapping to where ever the envelope goes - which is ok, as this means the user controls envelope with pressure)

but perhaps it might be nice to introduce dz (as velocity), and then have a velocity input on envelopes,
or perhaps even better just a multiplier input, could be nice with the LFO/Seq ... and even used between env 1 / 2 and you could remove the x Env1.. as this could be handled by the more generic solution.

anyway just ideas...

BTW, agent has been released, to hopefully a few will be playing with it this weekend :o)

I've added some more info on the g+ eigenharp community that may be of interest.